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View Full Version : can I swap out my CA95 motor with a 160?


KellieLyne
09-10-2009, 04:18 PM
Does anyone know the differences between these two motors? Can I easily swap them out or is there a major difference?

Smithers
09-10-2009, 05:12 PM
Do you have a cherry CA95 that needs an engine? There is a major difference. The 160's have much better gearing for speed and it has a much better cam chain arrangement as well. The engine is an updated 150 basically. The transmissions were updated to work better/ smoother.

It's kind of hard to justify the effort it takes to find another engine and install it if you already have an "ok" running 150cc. You can find CA160 motorcycle cheap in great shape. I would be surprised... really surprised if the 160cc engine won't plug right into a Benly 150 frame and wiring harness.

KellieLyne
09-10-2009, 05:57 PM
I am not sure if you recall, but I bought a 1965 CA95, that was in really good condition, or so I thought. However, it is smoking, and upon further investigation it is spitting oil out the exhaust. I know this could just be a ring piston issue, but my husband has NEVER worked on one of these before, and he was wondering if it would be easier to just pick up another motor. He saw a 160 on ebay, and thought maybe we would TRY to pick it up to have an extra just to error on the side of caution. What do you think? I know you have experience on the 150's, what do you think? The rest of my bike EXCELLENT CONDITION.

Smithers
09-10-2009, 07:30 PM
Ah yes! I have tons of questions to answer all the time (consulting tech 24/7) so it was hard for me to remember your case but I remember of course. If you want to ride your bike you would be VERY wise to put a 160cc engine into it. It's a big big difference. If you went and rode them back to back you would find a huge difference between the two. I've taken my CA160 on the freeway, no joke, at 65-70mph flat out. It was crazy I admit (original tires : ) but I can say I did it! There is NO way I would do that on the 150. It's not possible.

Now the CB160 has quite a bit more power even still. BUT it has dual carbs on it and they would hit the frame in a Dream style chassis. I bet those CB160 bikes and engines will go for at least twice what the CA models bring. They use those CB engines and frames for racing. They are a lot faster to say the least.

Smithers
09-10-2009, 07:34 PM
The Honda 160 engine looks a lot better than the 150cc engine too. They machined the Honda name into the side. The CA95 150 engine looks like a pre-WWII era engine.

KellieLyne
09-10-2009, 08:30 PM
we are going to try and pick it up, but who knows, it is always the luck of the draw. I am definitely planning on riding this bike though. I am a 39 year old mom who is tired of getting beat up on a dirt bike. And at 5 feet tall, my options are limited. lol Not to mention these little bikes are just too cool.

KellieLyne
09-10-2009, 08:32 PM
I have that that 150 at a whopping 50mph definitely sketchy. :D

Smithers
09-10-2009, 08:59 PM
So that's the bike there in the picture? And how many miles are on the engine? That bike is too nice. It looks way too shiny to be original though. No way that's original paint. It's been very well cared for. You might want to have that engine fixed as it would be a shame to separate them.

KellieLyne
09-11-2009, 01:28 PM
Yes it was very well cared for. The only part of the bike that has been repainted is one side of the forks, as far as I can tell. There definitely IS some chips and very minor dings on the front fender. But other than that, the bike is very clean. As far as miles on this thing, the speedo says 5096. But we all know, it is very easy to buy then on ebay, so I have no REAL proof either way. The engine LOOKS pretty clean, but my husband said there is carbon build up, and does not believe it when the previous owner said that they just redid the rings and pistons. I too agree, that this engine needs to fixed and put back into the bike. I want to keep it original if I can help it. The thought is to swap the motors so I can ride it until the original motor is fixed. Then, I can keep the 160 just in case something happens to the 150 motor. Does that sound stupid? I don't know yet, I am just thinking about it.

SixtyFiveCA95
09-11-2009, 02:37 PM
Doesn't sound stupid to me. In fact, I'm thinking of doing the same swap in my '65. Same deal. Nice bike, shot motor. Yours looks nicer, though.

Fortunately, I have both a CB160 and CA160 engine. You could put a CB160 engine one there if you swap the one-carb head from a CA160.

The top of the engine fitting the bracket welded onto the frame might be different with the 160. Otherwise, the bottom half is a direct bolt in. In fact, somebody tried to put the CB160 engine that I have onto one of the CA95's my dad and I picked up. It totally didn't work with it being two-carbs.

With a CA160 head on there, you might be able to pull it off. I'll take another look at my CA160 frame and compare it to my '65. If it's the same, swapping in a CA160 engine or strange CA/CB hybrid like I'm considering would totally work.

KellieLyne
09-11-2009, 04:08 PM
Well, it looks promising, I will definitely keep you all posted if we do decide to switch it out. We are just waiting for the for sure deal on the 160 engine, then the work begins. Thanks for all the feedback.

Kellie:)

Smithers
09-11-2009, 09:24 PM
Yeah the 160 engine is the one to have. I can't say if using the CA head on the CB engine would be doable. I would keep the CB engine to the side for sale since they are worth more. Or someone might trade out a good CA engine for it I'm sure.

Just don't throw anything away no matter what you do. :)

SixtyFiveCA95
09-12-2009, 08:30 AM
I was thinking the same thing about the CB160 motor. The CA engine is basically complete, but somebody picked a few parts off of there. Mostly covers and small stuff. I'm not sure how good it is. I guess it would have to be taken apart and inspected.

Smithers
09-12-2009, 08:43 AM
I wish I had a CB160! Those things are awesome. And they can be ridden anywhere as they have much more power and the tube frames are 10x stronger than the stamped steel of the CA. There are a couple for sale across the country and I would gladly have one shipped over here if I had more room! Those things are cool.

SixtyFiveCA95
09-12-2009, 10:57 AM
I'm hoping that someday I'll find a CB160 to drop that engine into. Those bikes sure have a HUGE following, don't they? I've only seen one out here for sale (Wisconsin). It was about as nice as my Benly, and they wanted a grand.

If I could find a decent enough restorable one, I already have the engine. Otherwise, I might make a little mini-chopper or bobber, and it'll have a really cool CB160 engine in it.

KellieLyne
09-12-2009, 12:23 PM
Okay, well I did it! I bought the 160 motor (less the carburator) for $175 bucks. Now the work begins! And of course I have more questions, but the most pressing is..... will my carb from my 150 fit on the 160 motor, or do I need to find a different one? :o

SixtyFiveCA95
09-12-2009, 04:31 PM
That's a good question. There's nothing about this online, so the only way to know is to try to fit a CA95 carb on there. I'm going to attempt it the next time I have access to that CA160 engine that I have. My guess is that the carb that's on your bike would probably fit right on that 160 motor and work.

The bigger ? is whether you can use the CA95 exhaust with the CA160 engine. That's the question that's bugging me. It won't be too hard to find some kind of carb that will work with it, but exhausts for these 60s Hondas cost a small fortune.

SixtyFiveCA95
09-12-2009, 04:42 PM
http://en.allexperts.com/q/Motorcycle-Repair-837/Honda-CA-engine-swap.htm

This guy knows his stuff.

KellieLyne
09-12-2009, 05:33 PM
Well, guess I better get to searching for different pipes..... I knew it couldnt be THAT easy. OF COURSE not lol. I think I will wait until it gets here to tell my husband lol. I don't want to hear about it twice. lol. <sigh> here we go again..... :o Thanks for the heads up on that. I am definitely glad there is this site AND the internet, geez what did we ever do BEFORE the internet????

SixtyFiveCA95
09-12-2009, 05:50 PM
You can still keep the mufflers, so it isn't all bad, since repro mufflers cost $$$

KellieLyne
09-13-2009, 10:05 AM
Well I purchased a pair of exhaust pipes, and my husband has a tube bender, (we own a commercial plumbing business) so I think we are set. Only thing is, to make sure we don't "kink" the pipes. However, I think we have skills in that department. We shall see, the engine will be here sometime end of next week. I am making sure that my digital camera is well charged. I loved the idea that Smithers had about taking pictures throughout the tear down and rebuilds so that way you have a good reference point. Like I said, great to have this valuable thread.

Smithers
09-13-2009, 10:23 AM
Use the sand bending method. :D http://www.rorty-design.com/content/sand_bending.htm

They have them on Ebay but they probably wouldn't be as nice as you could make them. I wouldn't mind trying a couple bends on my friends machine but I don't have any thinwall tubing on hand. You'll have to flare the ends a bit as well. Of course I'm thinking about making some on the verge of overkill though. I've seen some really trick racing exhausts that people have made for their vintage Honda racers.

KellieLyne
09-13-2009, 10:44 AM
As we are sitting here watching spike TV, I saw your reply and read it to my husband, he explained to me the sand bending method, makes sense. I bought the pipes off ebay. May sound bad, but I am not going to get married
to this new motor and exhaust. I just want a fill in until I get the 150 motor worked on then, it's going back in the bike. So, custom exhaust isn't going to happen in my garage. Just a little tweaking to make them work, you know a DOOFER, (do for now). :) Well shows almost over and we're out to the garage. We are fitting the bike with leather saddlebags so I can actually carry things to and from work. Oh and BTW, I think we will try the restore and see what happens. Heck, might as well see what happens. If it doesn't work we are out what??? 10 bucks?

SixtyFiveCA95
09-13-2009, 01:16 PM
At least your 150 is repairable........mine tossed a rod and blew right through the case!

I really, really, really hope that the 160 I have turns over, because I'm not sure whether I could pull off a complete rebuild.

SixtyFiveCA95
09-13-2009, 02:24 PM
Oh well, at least the bike itself isn't bad.

SixtyFiveCA95
09-13-2009, 02:42 PM
But this sure is.........

Smithers
09-13-2009, 08:52 PM
Kellie once you put the 160 engine in your bike you won't want to put the 150 back in unless you are parking it for the collection when you are done riding it. :) Yeah just throw on some pre-made pipes and be done with it. I'm just getting worked up on building a custom exhaust because I'm in the middle of a couple projects and it's what I've been focusing on. Let me find the pictures of the race bikes with the super custom exhausts.

Yeah that white bike of SixtyFives is a nice one. I wonder what conditions led to the engines demise. I hope the 160 swaps work out because it is one hell of an upgrade. Just make sure and record your VIN #'s to keep the paperwork straight I guess.

I'm looking at some 150 frame pictures and I bet I could make a CB160 engine fit in there without having to do too much work. That would be awesome. Someday I'll find a decent 250 or 305 Dream, go through the engine and ride that sucker cross country. Those bikes could totally do it as long as everything is assembled with Lock-Tite.

Smithers
09-13-2009, 09:12 PM
Here are a couple shots of some aftermarket exhaust pipes. I know everyone wants the stock pipes but these are pretty interesting.

http://www.fourwheelperformance.com/honda/ca95_exhaust_04.jpg

This pipe came off of my parts bike I picked up a while back. The other one was way too rusted and fell apart. It was made by a company called Rocky? It's pretty neat looking and much lighter than factory and you wouldn't have to worry about damaging these since they are so small.

http://www.fourwheelperformance.com/honda/ca95_exhaust_01.jpg

http://www.fourwheelperformance.com/honda/ca95_exhaust_02.jpg

SixtyFiveCA95
09-14-2009, 01:11 PM
Those are awesome! If I didn't have a nice set of mufflers on my bike already, I would soooo get a set of those.

As for my bike, even with the blown motor, I can't complain. All I have in it is $200 + $10 worth of spray paint that I got at Family Dollar that I used to freshen it up in spots. It was rebuilt/repainted sometime in the 70's, I'm guessing, and had the white had gotten a bit dirty.

SixtyFiveCA95
09-14-2009, 01:27 PM
It almost looks like those scrambler pipes are stock flat mufflers with a heat shield and different header pipes. That setup is cool.

Those pipes you have are pretty interesting as well.

Speaking of cool, check out this pic of a Cafe' style Dream that I found online. Clubman bars look awesome. Maybe somewhere down the road I'll consider doing my '65 up to look like this.

KellieLyne
09-14-2009, 03:14 PM
Hey sixtyfive,
I saw that picture a while ago and showed my 17 year old son, he also thinks that bike is awesome. He is trying to get me to do that to a white 305 that I bought. Um the 305, in case your wondering, NEEDS HELP! That is a major winter project. It is in solid condition as far as body, some light surface rust, but something is definitely up with the kick starter, and it looks like someone left it out in their back yard for many years lol. I originally wanted a white sixtyfive so I am a bit envious of your bike, um, ( minus the engine issues lol.) And Smithers, I guess I should probably tell you the WHOLE story, see, my husband, he does NOTHING quickly! So, that is why I am concerned about him taking my engine apart. I don't know if it is a GUY thing, but I have to tell you, woman are better multi taskers lol. I made the mistake of letting him "restore" my 1939 Chevy. It was already done, but the person who did it, didn't do a very good job so my husband thought, oh lets just do a color change, (Do I even need to say anymore?) now, my car is in 1000 different pieces, and his crap is being stacked on top of it. So, about that 150, and not wanting to put it back in after riding it with the 160 in it? LOL, the 160 will be ready for a rebuild before I get that 150 back into that bike LOL.

KellieLyne
09-14-2009, 03:21 PM
Those pipes are very interesting, wouldn't your leg get a little warm? and if you have plastic side covers, wouldn't they melt? Speaking of that, I bought some metal side covers off ebay. I didn't realize that the 150's came with metal side covers???

SixtyFiveCA95
09-14-2009, 03:37 PM
305 Dreams are awesome, and nearly impossible to find out here. I would love to have one of those someday.

Envious of my bike? But yours is absolutely gorgeous. Mine's more of a "20 footer", you get closer and can see some flaws. But I was pleased with my spray-paint handiwork. It looked nowhere near what it looks like now, especially when I redid the tank. It was all dirty and the paint was yellowed. Now it looks like a "nice original".........nobody has to know, lol.

And, the "Guy Thing"? Sounds like my father, with two MG's taken apart, and we're currently doing two CA95's from the six that we have. I chose the white one as mine 'cuz it was the most complete. And now I have to swap the motor on mine, so that makes three.

I expect all of this to take an eternity.

SixtyFiveCA95
09-14-2009, 03:52 PM
There was actually what appeared to be a pretty decent 305 Dream on Craigslist for $900. If I had anywhere near $900, I probably would've went to look at it. But I'm broke. I also missed out on a 305 Superhawk for $1000 that actually ran and was in pretty decent shape. A Superhawk!

I seriously need to learn how to budget and save money, lol.

KellieLyne
09-14-2009, 05:28 PM
Well sixtyfive, this is a picture of the bike I ALMOST bought. Problem being, they wouldn't come down $300.00 and I wasn't about to pay $3800.00 for it. My limit was $3500.00, not a penny more. It was in NJ and I would have to ship it for $600 and that was really getting into more money. So I finally told the guys, no thanks, and bought my bike for $1600.

SixtyFiveCA95
09-14-2009, 05:56 PM
$3800 for one of these things is nuts. I've seen beautiful 305 dreams for that kind of money on ebay. I like these bikes, but I couldn't see spending any more than the $1600 that you spent. A CA95 is something that you're supposed to ride an have fun on. They haven't caught or become desireable enough to warrant a nearly four grand price tag, even if it's practically showroom new.

Even with the engine issues, you got a much, much better deal.

Smithers
09-14-2009, 07:33 PM
Yeah there is NO WAY it's worth that much. I've seen absolutely beautiful ones for sale in the midwest for $1200-$1500. And I mean these things were perfect. That's about the price I'm thinking they are worth. I wouldn't sell mine for $2,000 though. I would maybe think about $4,000. :) I almost don't know if I want to change the tires on it ever. They are original so I don't think I ever will. I'll just stop riding it if they wear down any more. I would rather fix up my CB72 and ride that around! The 160 is almost just to look at nowadays.

I let go of a perfect Honda S90 when I was a Junior in high school and I regret it. The adult who bought it from me sold it instantly and sent it to Japan. What a jerk!

SixtyFiveCA95
09-15-2009, 08:51 AM
Mine has one of the original Ohtsu tires up front, but it's so bad that I'll have to put another one on before I actually ride it. I bought a nice ribbed Cheng Shin for $20 at a swap meet that has just the right look. The one in the back is a Yokohama that's period-correct, but I think that somebody put that on later. Most of these bikes came with Ohtsus front/rear.

I really wish I had an S90! Those are so cool. And the best part is that there are a few Chinese companies that make knock offs of the old Honda engine design that can be retrofitted to them. And they don't cost much.

SixtyFiveCA95
09-15-2009, 09:13 AM
There was an S90 project bike on Craigslist not far from where I live for $150but I already have two bikes as it is, and don't have $150 sitting around to buy another one. But I sure wish I did.

Smithers
09-15-2009, 05:21 PM
Ah you missed out! I would have grabbed that thing.

SixtyFiveCA95
09-15-2009, 05:43 PM
My funds are limited. There's another one on there in my area for $200 that sound even better than the first one.

Plus, I have a 160 to rebuild now that my 150 is toast.

Smithers
09-15-2009, 05:57 PM
Oh boy this is definitely another thread we can start! LOL
I mean unfinished projects AND another thread for hot Craigslist deals! Fun to window shop.

KellieLyne
09-15-2009, 07:47 PM
Well Smithers, I tried the restore, and drove it for a couple of days a little here and there, still smokes, but, I did find something, a few metal parts in my oil. It made the oil look like metallic paint. Looks like I will be doing a complete rebuild on that motor. Anyways my new motor was shipped out today, and it's ETA is the 21st. About the once wished for bike, yeah they were asking too much. That bike eventually sold for $3650. <shrug> I guess somebody wanted it bad enough. I do like my black 150 now that I have it. I think, I would have been worried about riding the white one. You know, afraid of scratching it or something happening to it. But my husband said, well the white one probably doesn't smoke lol. Oh well, hopefully it will be a quick and somewhat low cost problem. I already have valves, pistons, rings, and a full gasket set. And Smithers..... what good is it if you don't ride it?????? That is something that I have decided, whatever I get, I'm going to RIDE IT! You know about two months ago, I didn't have a thought in my head about a Honda Dream, I didn't even know about them. I just stumbled upon one, and next thing you knew, I had one lol.

KellieLyne
09-21-2009, 06:41 PM
Hey, anybody know where I can obtain the bottom plate of a 160 motor, where the oil drain plug goes? Apparently when this motor was shipped that was damaged. Where on earth would I find one of those?:mad:

Smithers
09-21-2009, 10:52 PM
You can't grind it down and make it look better? Did it end up getting cracked or completely broken? Sorry to hear the guy didn't really package the engine up that well for shipping. That's annoying.

SixtyFiveCA95
09-22-2009, 12:01 PM
I have no idea where you'd find one of those besides maybe ebay, but CA160 parts are few and far between. You'd probably have better luck looking for it as a CB160 part, since the bottom cases are identical and there's a lot more CB160 stuff out there.

I hope you're not talking about the crankcase itself, because that would suck.

KellieLyne
09-22-2009, 12:03 PM
nope, it is broken.....broken.......broken......and broken......4 separate pieces, sort of hard to hold the oil in with broken parts. I did find one... in EUROPE lol, how long do you think that will take to get here??? Guess I won't be riding until next spring. Whatta drag.

SixtyFiveCA95
09-22-2009, 12:10 PM
I'm guessing that you mean the skid plate.

Smithers
09-22-2009, 12:34 PM
Well there are enough Honda 160's out there to give you hope. It's not like it's a rare bike or anything. When I see a couple parts on Ebay being sold by a person I always ask if they have other parts. And I always throw in an offer for the part they have before they reveal a price. Chances are always good that they want more than you want to pay. And of course since it's a kinda rare part to see listed on eBay I would ask them to sell it for like $35 shipped. It's well worth that but that price actually makes it worth their while to throw it in a box and put an address on it.

I wonder if they are the same design as the Benly 150. Then you would have a much broader market to choose from. Take a look and compare them.

KellieLyne
09-22-2009, 05:53 PM
this is the part that I need, it is the actual plate that the oil drain plug screws into. You see the solid black gasket at the bottom, it is the plate directly below that. I did find one lol in EUROPE! A woman with a mission and a debt card is a dangerous thing! Last night when my husband showed me two "little problems", I came back in from the garage and began hunting, and I think I was mumbling something about, "Oh sure, it couldn't just be easy now could it, this flipping cheap bike from ebay has cost me so much money, I could have had a new closet full of clothes, but OOOOOOH no, had to have a motorcycle!"

KellieLyne
09-24-2009, 06:22 AM
Thanks for the suggestion of looking at CB160's found one on ebay and bought it... it is going to be shipped out today 2nd day air. The internet... is awesome and so is this site. Hope you all have a great weekend.

Smithers
09-24-2009, 06:24 AM
Buying more motorcycles is more important right? I wanted to see how broken yours was that's why I asked for the picture. I know what it's supposed to look like. And now that I have your description of how yours is shattered I don't need to see the pieces I guess.

Here is a good set of CA95 pipes with flanges on eBay. Could be well worth it if someone needed these: Honda 150 header pipes (http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/63-Honda-Dream-150-CA95-Benly-Touring-Header-Pipes_W0QQitemZ260480136411QQcmdZViewItemQQptZMoto rcycles_Parts_Accessories?hash=item3ca5d374db&_trksid=p3911.c0.m14)

Smithers
09-24-2009, 06:37 AM
Someone has to keep all these old bikes going. Everyone here is doing a good job, we might see a flood of running old Hondas being restored maybe. Yeah I remember working on old bikes when I was a kid in my jr. high and high school days - NO INTERNET. It was hell and you had to seek out Honda guru's and mechanics in different towns to ask them questions of if they knew of any old Honda parts for sale! And we would have to travel around to get them! I have stories about that stuff but I'm sure everyone has stories about the horrible life we all had to endure without the internet. :D

I met up with all the guys in a coastal motorcycle group last night for a BBQ and an older gentleman was there that had raced Honda CB92 Benlys (http://www.motorcycleclassics.com/motorcycle-reviews/2007-03-01/honda-cb92-benly-the-first-super-sport.aspx)and all sorts of older Hondas! He has modified all sorts of classic engines for racing and I got so much info about swapping carbs and boring out cylinders from 150cc to 175cc and all that stuff. I've even been to his garage and seen his stash of modified racing parts he had made for a couple old Honda 150 and 160 engines (now larger displacement) that he never finished. He is currently restoring a Benly CB92 on his bench. I got a lot of ideas now and we talked about leaning conditions that I've experienced under full load with my CA160. One of these days I'll be visiting in his neighborhood and I'll get some pictures.

Yes the weekend is practically here. I'm riding my Aprilia to coffee this morning then putting it away before it gets super hot today. :)

Smithers
09-24-2009, 06:49 AM
My friend also said swapping the 150 for the 160 is a great idea and would be very smart if you wanted to ride it so we're on the right track for sure. I talked about the gearing ( I want to find some concrete numbers on this) and how much smoother then engine was as well as the ideal location of the timing chain on the CA160 engine. I forgot to mention that the CA95 has 3 main bearings (journals whatever : ) and the CA160 engine is a 4 mains. BIG DIFFERENCE! My friend reminded me of this.** Corrected the main bolt term and changed it to main bearings like I meant to say earlier. The coffee makes me type strange things sometimes in the morning. **

Smithers
09-28-2009, 10:41 PM
To punish myself I created a visual comparison between the CA160 and CA95 lower engine cases. You can clearly see how well supported the 4 main bearing Honda 160 crank is compared to the 3 bearing Benly 150 crankshaft. It feels like a completely different engine in the way of less vibration. And thank goodness the lower oil plug plate is replaceable on the CA160! On the contrary, if there happened to be some damage incurred to the CA95 oil plug area the lower crank case would be a gonner! I had the pleasure of swapping my lower case on my Benly due to some case damage. Stuff happens... especially if the irresponsible owner was hill climbing or jumping the poor little Honda. :D Actually what happened was that the bolts that hold the footpeg bar to the bottom of the engine got impacted so much that the bolt tore at the case and cracked it.

http://www.fourwheelperformance.com/honda/honda_motorcycle_main_bearings.jpg

For a TON of crankcase pictures and Honda Benly 150 transmission pictures head on over to the " (http://www.fourwheelforum.com/showthread.php?t=99)Splitting the Cases & Transmission" (http://www.fourwheelforum.com/showthread.php?t=99) thread.

KellieLyne
09-29-2009, 03:09 PM
Okay, NOW I understand the 4 main compared to the 3 main. Pictures with numbers lol gotta love it. I am forwarding all of this information to my husband (my mechanic lol), I am sure all of this information will come in handy. I did get all my parts in to fix that 160 motor. It looks like we will be starting on it sometime this week. I will definitely be in touch asking more questions. Thanks for all your help!

SixtyFiveCA95
09-29-2009, 06:55 PM
Did your 160 come with the carburetor? I tried to see if a 150 carb would fit, but it was way too small. So I have no idea what I'll do, since CA160 carbs never show up anywhere for sale. Plus, I have to find a carb spacer/manifold. That's going to be fun. Maybe there's another bike with a rubber manifold like my KZ200 has that I could fit on there. It would definitely open up my options as far as carbs that I could use goes.

The good thing, though, about the 160 is that it has a more common intake bolt spacing, as opposed to the 150's carb, which might've been made specifically for the CA95. My Mikuni had the right spacing but it wasn't the right shape. And that's a brand-new pit bike/atv/etc carb. So there has to be a carb that will work out there somewhere.

Smithers
09-29-2009, 09:31 PM
What wasn't the right shape with the Mikuni? I wish I had time to make adapters for a newer carb that we could source for cheap. Get some more ponies out of these bikes. : ) The 150 needs it. The 160 not so much.

KellieLyne
09-29-2009, 09:57 PM
Crap, the 150 carb won't fit that 160 motor? (sigh) Guess I will be looking for a new carb too. Does it ever end??? My 150 has a Keihin carb. Does that make a difference or is it still different? We havent gotten that far into the tear down, but I want to be prepared for whatever comes our way.

Smithers
09-29-2009, 10:24 PM
No. But it's fun!

KellieLyne
09-30-2009, 06:20 AM
Were you dropped on your head as baby??? lol. I'm kidding, actually, I am hoping for the best with this carb situation. If it doesn't fit, then I will be out hunting for one that does. Hey, just another set back.... not life altering.

Thanks for the heads up Sixtyfive, I had no idea that the carb might not fit, I mean I guess you always have that come up when you swap parts, or engines as that might be. Just one more hurdle. But I do have to say, rebuilding the 150, probably would have been easier lol. Oh well, gives the hubby something to do, right?

KellieLyne
09-30-2009, 12:42 PM
Hey SixtyFive, do you think that it is your brand of carb that keeps it from fitting, because I was looking at mine, and I think mine might work. I have a Keihin model. I mean I could be altogether wrong here, when I get the motor in the frame and all, but, looking at it, it looks like it should fit. Can you send me a picture of your carb? And maybe an explanation of why yours wont fit? I mean if it isn't too much trouble. I'm just curious. Thanks....

Kellie

SixtyFiveCA95
09-30-2009, 01:07 PM
My original carb was a Keihin as well. Most, if not all of these bikes came with Keihin pw20s. It won't fit without some kind of manifold. If you look at the pictures of Smithers' CA160 engine, you can see the difference in how a CA160 carb mounts to the engine:

http://www.fourwheelforum.com/showthread.php?t=199

They made some kind of adapter so the carb could be mounted on the 160. The carb itself appears to be the same size as a CA95 carb, and might be essentially the same carb. But w/o that adapter, it's way too skinny.

KellieLyne
09-30-2009, 09:16 PM
Now I see what you're talking about. Hmm... do you have any suggestions??? lol. I am thinking my husband will need to fabricate one of these "adapters".
He is really loving me at this point lol. Thanks for the picture... it helped.

KellieLyne
10-03-2009, 08:33 AM
I "THINK" I found a carburetor for my 160 w/manifold. I am waiting for it to be shipped, because something inside of me says, to believe it when I see it! I have searched and searched, and I have to tell you, these things are like gold, definitely well hidden.

Smithers
10-03-2009, 08:38 AM
Be glad you aren't working on the same period Ducati motorcycles. Dellorto carburetors are around 3-4 hundred and cost 2-3 hundred to rebuild properly. :D I was at my friends shop last night checking out his Ducati rebuild project and he was STOKED to get a steal of a deal on a Dellorto carb on Ebay for $320!! And it will need a little bit of work. They just don't exist basically. Supply and demand at it's finest!

It should be pretty easy to find one of those Chinese carbs and make it work. Just need to measure the bore of it and match it... and of course a little more work with the studs, just takes time. BUt yeah, if you found another 160 carb you are money.

KellieLyne
10-03-2009, 02:26 PM
Your friend must be single and have a lot of money. That sounds like a bike that would be pricey to own. Before buying this bike, I NEVER used Ebay, since my purchase, I just hit 50 purchases off ebay. Good idea, just a little TOO convienent, and I am one who HATES to shop. Although, I think I am good now. Nothing pressing that needs buying, well, until the next snag.

Hohlederschatten
10-03-2009, 10:48 PM
There are a few places to get Dellorto carbs for around $150. granted those are mostly for mopeds.

But who knows, you could be lucky.

KellieLyne
10-10-2009, 09:08 PM
is it possible to swap out a 150 motor on a CA95 and pop in a 160 engine from a CA160. Possible, well yeah, of course this means making many alterations like different exhaust, and different exhaust joints to mount the pipes to the head. Plus the carburetor does not swap between the two without a manifold ( which is extremely difficult to find) So I opted to search for a 160 carb, which is equally difficult to find. I know you can use different carbs and modify them to work, but remember, this was suppose to be an "easy" swap until I rebuilt the 150 to put back into the bike (trying to keep it original). Oh and I also needed a different clutch cable, because the 150 cable would not work. So, after buying all that, getting the 160 ready to swap, we came upon another hang up. The mounting bracket underneath the gas tank, does not accommodate the width of the 160 motor mounting bracket. From what I could tell, it was a little over 1/2 inch too small. Yeah we probably could have modified this bracket, but, remember, I wanted to keep the 150 engine to stay true to the history of the bike. So, we pulled the plug. We decided, that we did not want to bend the bracket or fabricate anything else to try to make this engine fit. If we were going to keep this engine in the bike, maybe we would have decided differently. I don't know what other issues we might have come across if we had decided to proceed, but I think that rebuilding the 150 engine will have to be easier than this headache. So now the 150 is pulled apart and we are inspecting it. Who knows what we will fine. Maybe in the end, that 160 WILL fit. LOL. Heck whats a little more work, and bit more money???? So, now the answer to that question will it fit? Guess someone else will have to be the one to figure that out. <sigh>. Who knows maybe I will come across a 160 honda needing a motor.... because it's an awfully large paper weight.

SixtyFiveCA95
10-11-2009, 05:40 PM
Looks like I'll have to find a new 150 engine then. Bummer. I sorta supected it might be too good to be true, but was hoping otherwise............

KellieLyne
10-12-2009, 11:59 AM
I didn't say it couldn't be done.... just I'm not going to do it. I've have to say, I was a little disappointed because after talking to Smithers, I thought COOL I can cruise with the 160 for a while and see the difference in power. Then take my time putting the 150 back together. I just couldn't see doing all these modifications to make a temporary motor fit. The object was to do a simple swap for a DOFER... you know Do for now, but heck, do you know how much money Ive spent already on this "simple swap"? I told my husband, its going on ebay. He said nah just keep it, you might end up with another bike that your willing to make alterations to. I just can't justify doing that to this bike, its in too good of shape.

SixtyFiveCA95
10-12-2009, 03:13 PM
Well, I do have a CA160 frame to take the mounts from, but I'd have to cut them off that frame, cut the old 150 mounts off off of my bike, and then weld the CA160 mounts on my frame.........not so sure that I want to go through all of that. Now, if my 160 engine was a runner, that's another story. But it has to be rebuilt.

I wouldn't do it with your bike either. That thing is gorgeous. Mine's nowhere near that nice looking. Wouldn't feel bad doing to mine, though.

Smithers
10-12-2009, 03:54 PM
Ahhh just will take a little more work to make the 160 work. Sorry to hear it's not so plug and play. If you could weld a new bracket on to mount the engine you could just use a spacer when you got put the 150 back in. And the carb adapter - I didn't think they would be so different. I wish you were closer so I could help make it fit. It would be worth it. But let us know what you guys find in the Benly engine.

I just bought a set of original exhaust headers off of Ebay for $20 for the 150. The ones on the blue Honda are deteriorating on the edges that meet the engine. After talking about fabbing a new exhaust I thought having some spare originals wouldn't be a bad idea.

SixtyFiveCA95
10-12-2009, 05:33 PM
I might still do it. I already have the CA160 frame to remove the mount from, and I already have the exhaust parts because I have that CB160 engine with the pipes still on it. And the pipes and joints are the same as the CA engine.

I can't find a good 150 engine out here anyways, and I know that the 160 would be much better since I plan to ride it alot. Plus, it isn't prone to that pesky bearing failure that 150s were known to have. Pretty sure that that was what happened to mine.

KellieLyne
10-13-2009, 06:25 PM
Bearing failure?????? Can you fill me in on this??? Oh and Smithers, we found that on the 150 motor, the first and second rings were put in the wrong positions and one of the rings was put in upside down. So, we are taking a closer look at the engine, and doing some much needed cleaning and inspecting it before we put it all back together.

SixtyFiveCA95
10-14-2009, 02:58 PM
I don't think that the bearing failure possibilty is a huge thing. These were, and are, known to be great little bikes.

But I think that I was one of the unlucky ones. Sometimes when engines sit too long w/o being run..........................

Smithers
10-15-2009, 07:34 AM
Come on you guys don't get lazy on me. Seriously the 160 engine is a huge improvement over that 150cc. And we've outlined why but I know there are hills around where I live that I would not attempt to ride up on the Benly 150. Traffic would just steam roll me and these are some of the only roads to get around town so I'm very limited on where I can ride that bike compared to my 160 that I can go anywhere on.

I'm going to also repeat the fact that I actually took the 160 ON THE FREEWAY doing 65mph with a big rig on my butt threatening to run me over... but I did it for a couple miles. http://www.fourwheelperformance.com/phorum/icon_ride.gif I'm sure that high rpm riding stressed the frame pretty good and loosened some nuts and bolts but it was crazy to hear that engine rev so high and not miss a beat! Amazing engines. But there is no way the 150 engine and transmission is capable of that kind of performance, no way.

Hohlederschatten
10-15-2009, 12:38 PM
I thought the top speed of the 150's was a tad below 90??? :confused:

Smithers
10-15-2009, 01:30 PM
90 km/h = 56 mph

KellieLyne
10-15-2009, 04:46 PM
I knew you'd have something to say about it lol. Smithers, you don't understand, my husband is about to strangle me. This 150 is just being put back together and we are moving on to a new project lol. I am SURE I will be finding another bike to put this 160 in, especially because you have peaked my curiousity. lol.

Smithers
10-15-2009, 05:16 PM
My 160 does wheelies. Now go get to work on yours. :]

KellieLyne
10-15-2009, 06:45 PM
Hey, my 150 did 65 mph, granted it was in the bed of our truck! Wheelies you say??? Sometimes that happens when there is too much weight on the back of the bike. KIDDING!!!!!!

KellieLyne
10-18-2009, 08:45 PM
YES!!!!!!!!!! Okay, well we got it started FINALLY!!!!!! We had a hard go of it today, spent most of the day trying to figure out WHY it wouldn't start. Go figure, it was grounding out the points ignition plate against the side cover. She sounds great! I haven't had a chance to "ride" it yet. We need to get out the grease gun and make sure everything is lubed. Then, its open road. It is nice to actually see it run without smoke coming out the ass end. :D Now, its time to start the 305!

Smithers
10-18-2009, 11:26 PM
Yeah the wheelies never happened. The bikes frame would just fold in half if it had that much power so that's a good thing.

Good work, just ride the darn thing! It will put along just fine I'm sure. Now you can sleep soundly at night. -_- ZZZzzzz...... Time to move on to bigger and better things! Congrats you two.

KellieLyne
10-25-2009, 07:17 PM
lol .... yeah after riding the 150 for the first time after the rebuild, we realized it definitely needed the clutch redone. So, we stole the parts from the 160! Don't worry, they will be replaced. We have some parts already on the way, we just wanted to go out for a ride today. Since it was gorgeous out today. Nice ride, but I didn't dare take that little bike over 45 mph. The 305 is already on the motorcycle lift. :D

Smithers
10-25-2009, 07:38 PM
Perfect! See you're already happy to have the spare engine laying around. The parts are solid gold when you need them and have them right there. I ran out of shielding gas for my welder today so I was pretty bummed. Ok let's see the 305! Go ahead and begin a new thread for that one. : )